Traits/Battle System Problem

[Rodak]

Well, I might as well ask this here as well as over at that other board where I go. I asked there, but got told to learn the Battle System. While I am willing to take the time to do so, I would rather not. And besides, I was told that this board is better than the others... so this is a great test question.

My problem is this: I'm working on a trait script for an NPC and wanted to "pretend" he was casting a spell (that's a very simplified explanation, but it gets to the point quicker). What I did was create a few visual effects and, in battle, randomly call one then display text stating what happened and try to reduce the HP of an enemy (or even all enemies... whichever is easier!) by a set ammount.

I managed to reduce the HP of party members by a fixed ammount (using the single command Attributes:HP:Subtract), but can't seem to effect enemies this way. I am trying to avoid creating new abilities and direct effects since this is a Non-Player Character and the effects are used nowhere else. Surrounding the Attribute command with "Make Active Character" did not help. I tried to play with the "Swap Attributes and Variables" commands with no success. I played with battle flags and variables, but many could not be changed with Data commands.

I have read the FAQ's and Tutorials here and at the Pavilionboards, and, while they are excellent and extremely detailed, they are mostly for customizing the Default Battle System. I am simply trying to fool it!

So, briefly, my question is this: Is there a simple way to damage enemies by a set number (similiar to the effect of the Attributes:HP:Subtract command on party members) or do I really have to make an Ability, Direct Effect, and whatever else is needed to create new things like this?

I think it must be possible due to the simplicity of damaging the party this way (with NO battle commands whatsoever!).

Post Script: What's a Nado?

[NASH7777]

Well I've never used the DBS myself, I've always made my own ACBS like zelda. so I won't be help there sorry :-(

But I can respond to your PS, Nado stands for Tornado, and doan for brandon, Brandon Mintern runs the board and it's his nickname, brandon the tornado a.k.a Doan the nado

[Rodak]

Ahhh youth...

Us old folks are really terrible with all this shortening of big words like Tornado. But thanks for the information. I just like to know what I'm reading.

Even today's custom of acronyms eludes me. I'm pretty sure DBS is Default Battle System and CBS is Custom Battle System, but ACBS is a mystery to me (Active CBS; Advanced CBS; Amazing CBS; Anal-Retentive CBS... The possibilities are limitless!).

There are many more on these boards that leave me guessing, but I'll wait until I encounter them to ask. Unless somebody wants to make a "Fogey List" of acronyms for those of us who truly do not know these things.

Who says today's youth have nothing to teach us Old Fogeys?

Oh yeah, since I'm new here I should mention that I have no way of hooking my Playstation to a computer and thus have not seen anybody else's work. Further (-GASP-) I've never played Zelda or most of the popular RPG style (or any other style) games on the market these days.

I was just attracted by the notion of making my own game and the RPG Maker 2 system is actually pretty nifty!

Except for this "arbitrarily damaging the enemy" problem. Oh well, I have not found a problem with programming this game yet that I could not solve (except flying objects without invisible platforms) (but that can't be done!).

Peace.

[The Final Rune]

First off, welcome to the domain. Its good to see you branching out. Secondly, I have no idea what your talking about as far as traits go, but I guess that's because I have trouble getting my warps to work right! That aside, I'm sure some one here can answer your questions.

Don't know what kind of game you're making, but its good to have some of the 'older' generations playing along with us.

You should look into a max drive, it'll let you copy save games to and from the internet, and right now they're going for about $25.

What is a Nado you ask? Well, I know I read about it somewhere, but I can't remember where exactly. You are welcome to go looking for it, but I'm not gonna do it.

Hope you find out all the info you need to help you out.

Also, if you've had any trouble with the map editor check out my MEGuide by clicking on my signature for it. And be sure to check out DungeonWarden's DBS FAQ available here and at the Pavilion, you might find your answer in there.

Good luck!

[Deleted]

Well, what you want to do is along the lines of what I've done: eliminating the default system for the DBS and running it all manually. What I don't get is why you only want this o n e ability to do this, and why you want it to be a flat damage...?

[Rodak]

Well, loathe as I am to admit it, I was just trying to imitate the effect of a custom battle system without all the work! I have limited time to devote to this and thought I could bypass learning the battle system this way.

The reason for the fixed ammount of damage is equally lazy. I just thought it would be easier. I was going to include multipliers based on the characters' level, but that was waiting until I could direct the damage how I wanted.

I guess this means I have to let my big plumbing project go for another weekend and spend a few hours with the battle system (gotta keep the priorities in order!).

I'm still convinced that there must be a way to trick the battle system without rewriting it, but it may be easier to learn how to trigger various specific abilities within a trait script. Then make the new abilities. Something about which I have no idea (yet)!

Peace.

[BloodKnight]

Um, let me get this cleared up for my old self here. You want to make a custom battle system(using different text boxes, commands and such?), within the DBS, without a lot of work? Well, there's gonna be a lot of work involved, I just want to know, because well...there may be an easy solution.

[Deleted]

Why do you only want o n e ability to be like this though? It'd be easier to make all similar abilities (like magical attacking) be run and formulated the same way.

[Rodak]

OK, I guess I am not making myself clear. I am not trying to customize the battle system. I am just trying to create a sort of "Hidden Ability" which will inflict damage on the enemy directly from a trait script.

I thought the phrasing above was concise, but I guess not. So here it is : a complete spoiler of one of the more amusing aspects of the game on which I am working. But if put in context I hope you will be able to better understand what I am trying to do.



***** Spoiler Warning ******
------------------------------------------
SPOILER REMOVED AS THE PROBLEM HAS BEEN SOLVED AND IT WOULD RUIN A COOL SURPRISE IF YOU READ IT BEFORE PLAYING! IF YOU GOTTA KNOW (FOR PURPOSES OF MAKING YOUR OWN GAME) JUST ASK! I JUST DON'T WANT IT TO BE RUINED WITHOUT A GOOD REASON!
-------------------------------------------

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Peace.

[Deleted]

Okay, I see.

I'm thinking the problem is that a Direct Effect needs to be used to determine a target. I haven't worked with traits any myself though, but if there's a way to use a Direct Effect in a trait script... DW?

[Dungeon Warden]

Okay, I finally got around to testing this out and I found that the only way to target the enemy is with an ability or item (items include weapons). The simplist way to do this is to set Action: Itm/Ably to equal the database number of the item or ability you wish to use.

Sorry, but you can't target an enemy from the trait script directly. This is because Targeted Enemy is set by the action and can't be changed manually. You can set what enemy you want to target, but until a direct effect script runs the targeting system won't be activated. Note that an indirect effect also requires a direct effect to run first.

As you already know, you can directly effect the characters. I suppost this is so you can create a character that heals every turn, has a disease that causes damage every turn, or whatever without needing an indirect effect. The most important reason is so you can change the agility at the beginning of the turn before battle order is set.

Remember to use the trait flag. Off = beginning of round, On = during characters action.

My FAQ goes into a lot of detail on the Direct effect editor so creating the effect you want shouldn't be too hard, just more work them you were hopeing to deal with.

[Rodak]

Well, this is a pretty good day so far!

I got my 'puter back from the shop and now once again have internet access at home (still can't hook the PS2 up, gimme time).

But Thanks Muchly Dungeon Warden for cutting down that wrong tree up which I was barking!

Problem solved!

Here is how I did it (without learning much at all about the battle system, just "winging it") (based on DW's suggestions of course...) for those who care:

I copied and pasted a weapon that looked cool (any one would do really) and then deleted it! Next I used the "Trash Method" of seeing where it was used.

I went through all the scripts associated with it and copied and pasted a few that looked promising.

The game is nowhere near the PC, so if you want a detailed explanation, just ask and I'll post all the details, but the short version is this:

I made the Trait scrip just the one line : Set Battle Action:Attack

Then found the bit of script that called the VFX for this weapon (I think it was "Hit 1") and substitued the ENTIRE original trait script there

I just then went through those other bits of script that needed dialogue changed - -and copied, pasted, changed, and substituted. These were easily found and processed by going through the slots in the Item and Party Member sections for the weapon and the character.

Next I set the weapon to be equipped to the character and it does everything I wanted it do. And more!!

OK, now the big question... Should I edit the previous post and remove the Spoiler? *** I DID! I CUT SOME CLUES TO THE PLOT FROM THIS POST AS WELL. ***

I only ask because the only people likely to play the game are also likely to see that (if they have not already!) and I did want it to be a surprise! *** I TOLDJA SO!***

I'll leave it there for a while, but I may decide to remove it, so save it to your hard drive if you want a permenant copy! *** TOO LATE! ***

And a final note to those intimidated by the battle system:

IT AIN'T POOP!

I just did a major modifaction to it without any more help than is on this page.

That is not to take anything away from Dungeon Warden's FANTASTIC and possibly most comprehensive out there FAQ! It was invaluable. But in this instance his biggest help was just telling me that what I was attempting could not be done and suggesting the use of an item! I still can't get used to programming for shared file systems!!

I Miss DOS.

Thanks again for your help.

[Dungeon Warden]

Glad to hear you finally worked something out. I would have gone the other way - taking a blank item and making a weapon that had no name and couldn't be removed and then adding the scripts as needed, but your method works too.

Ah, DOS. I remember it well.

[Rodak]

Yup, I hope to become familiar enough with the system to start with blank stuff, but by copying a working item I was able to track all the scripts and events through it and simply modify. If I had to start from scratch I would not know where to put many bits and certainly would not have finished overnight!

It is the "lazy-man's way" but it gets results and I still have time to wallow in my own feces (I have a nasty plumbing problem I gotta fix all by myself... NEVER, EVER buy a Government Home... HUD are EVIL INCARNATE and can sell you a house even if it is not legally habitable!!!).

It's a long story.

Peace.

[vespuleth]

hope your sewege problem gets worked out. glad to hear you got your rpgm2 problem solved. its odd that you did it in that order. (shouldnt the sewer problem take higher priority?). i only programmed a little in dos, but it still took me a long time to break the 'procedural program' habits and get into oop. id delete the spoiler if i were you.

~ves

welcome to the boards.

[Rodak]

Thanks for the welcome.

And, for the record, yes. The sewage problem did come first. Sort of. I did all this while waiting on a friend who knows more of plumbing than I to arrive. I just solved it far faster than expected and had it working 99% before he arrived. It just sounded sillier to phrase it that way, and it was not inaccurate, so I went with it! Anything for a bad joke!! And if that confused you, well... wait until you see the game. I really just can't take anything seriously.

Oh yeah, the sewer problem is too big for amateurs like me and my friend. It seems to be tree roots growing into the line. Time to "Call Roto-Rooter" and give them a week's pay I really need for other things. Oh well. Could be worse.

And thanks for the advice about the spoiler. It'll be removed after I finish this post.

And about DOS; it is not dead!! Windows is not an operating system! It is just a big fancy program running on DOS and pretending to be an operating system!!

So there Bill Gates! I've told the entire board your dirty little secret!! Take That! Now get out there and make us a real operating system and you'll probably find a lot less trouble with hackers, viruses, and bugs!!

Bill Gates does read this right?

[vespuleth]

once a week, or when i call him and tell him that someone has posted something for him. usually fridays though. you may have to wait. hes bad about responding.